Getting Real, staying lean and learning to say no

That's actually our starting point as well . So, in most cases, we are guests; thankfully, they invite us as guests to places. We discuss the same thing there as well . So we actually solved our own problem, man. So, in the investment world, we say this all the time. You can't just sit down in the morning and think, " What should I start to become an entrepreneur?"

You really have to solve your own problem for a result to emerge. Exactly. 100% bro. That's great. And there's another heading here, man. What do you think about that? There's a thread titled "Haven Enemy". Oh, isn't this our blacklist, bro? At work. Yes. Greetings everyone. Hello everyone, and welcome to the second episode of our podcast. Ale, hello. How are you? Hi. Exactly. Very good. Good morning my baby.

Super. Good, very good indeed. Our previous episode scared us, so we said it might take a long time. So we moved on to the second part . We might release Part 2 as a separate video . Maybe we can connect them from here. It's entirely up to us. However you want, we can separate them if we want, and so on. Now, we've actually talked about Getting Real.

So, in the book, we really examined the aspects of the task that were compatible with us, based on a general, rough outline. We looked at what we could do and so on. Now we decided to take a deeper dive and look at it section by section. If you're ready, I can take a look at some topics and things like that . huh. We saw that things weren't going as we wanted.

We'll move on to another topic. What's going to happen? It's recording it already. Go ahead, brother. Should we share our screen? Should we try a different concept ? What are you saying? Open it, bro. Okay, screen sharing. I agree completely . Here you go. Just because it's a podcast, I don't want our esteemed listeners to misunderstand it . It'll be alright . You're saying they shouldn't watch it.

They shouldn't listen to that. Exactly. What would the screen look like if I did it like this? Is that good? Very good. Exactly. Wonderful. Intro. Let's move on to the introduction. Wonderful. Exactly. it says "starting line," by the way, that's how the book works. There are layers and things like that here and there. Each layer goes to its own, u, thing. Exactly. All the topics we've been discussing are essentially covered here.

Okay, so we can examine those with the big headlines slowly. For example, it says "starting line" . There are a few points here. For example, it says "what's your problem?" or something like that for chapter 5 . It's basically saying, " Solve your own problems." Ours is just like that, ours already. Yes. So I think this is pretty critical. Because, I think, you need to be interested in the work you do .

So that you can draw a proper conclusion. That's why I think this event is really quite critical. That's actually our starting point too. So, thankfully, most of the time we're guests, they invite us to places as guests. We're talking about it there too, I mean, we really solved our own problem, man. So, in the investment world, we constantly say this. You can't just sit down in the morning and think, "What should I start to become an entrepreneur?"

You really have to solve your own problem for a result to emerge. Exactly. 100% bro. Very good. So there's also a heading for something here, man. What do you think about that? There's a thread titled "Haaven Enemy". Oh, isn't this our blacklist, bro? So, brother, I understand it this way... well, it's kind of like this. I don't know how you understood it, but it's like, you have information about what you're fighting against, in a way .

So, it's not just about having a rival company; it's about approaching it from the perspective that something you're doing should actually be the opposite of something else This corresponds to... that thing, by the way. Antihero. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. So, it's not like your motivation is just to become, say, the best project management tool in the world. On the other hand, we always stand against this kind of perspective, that there should always be a certain point of view .

I mean, I think we don't have one main enemy, but we've identified a few enemies . For example, we want to be the opposite of very closed-off companies. That's kind of where the open startup concept comes from, I think. I wo n't give 15 examples, but I feel like we don't have just one main enemy, but I was curious to hear from you. Do you think there is ?

So, in my opinion, Hardal is the antithesis of that . We're already against that kind of culture, you know, like the all-in-one culture. Everything in one place. Just use this and nothing else; that's actually the strategy of all companies, but we 're approaching it from the opposite angle. I think that's the point we're opposing. So, if you're already using something, go ahead and use it, but Hardal already exists to help you use it better.

So, because we're presenting it there from a completely different perspective, I think the added value of the product is exactly what we're fighting for. Because that's always the case, what's the difference between you and Google Antix? Yes. What's the difference between you and whatever else? We don't want to be one, that is. Onap shock solutions fall. Yes, that's right, that's right. Look, I joined. So, in my opinion, this is our enemy.

So, that's really what we're always fighting about. I agree, I agree. I really liked this. This thing, the approach. Then I think we can move on to the next thing. Stay lean. What do you think "stayin" means? Brother, this is actually something we discussed quite thoroughly in the previous part, I think . This whole thing boils down to minimizing effort, burden, and change costs, essentially all the key points.

For example, the "be yourself" part is nice here. I think we can investigate that a bit more. He's actually talking a lot about that here. So, just because you're being compared to big companies, don't act like a big company , don't act like a corporate company . Instead, being humane and friendly is quite critical, in my opinion. For example, you do this more often. So I think you have more of that in you.

Let's say there's a problem somewhere, right? Let's call the customers and explain what happened. For example, my corporate side tries to handle things a bit more in terms of crisis management and so on, but I think honestly, we're human too. The product is also gradually evolving, sorry about that. I think it provides great benefits to relationships, the product, the team, and so on. And I think it benefits the other party the most, the one using the product.

Because it's not from somewhere like that anyway. It's not like, "Let's build together." That communication is really important today; the person who will use that product might be working for one company today and switching to another tomorrow. That's why establishing communication and making that happen is so valuable. I think the part they're trying to pay attention to here is a bit more about not being messy. You know this general culture, like the lane startup, that lean startup thing, but it's a bit different, less mass, and that's where the analogy comes in.

I mean, why would you steer your infrastructure and technology towards that when you don't already have millions of users? You understand? It's all complex, incredibly complex, cloud structures and all that. I think we've passed through these stages very well. So, when the team was just three people, with only Mert, we were able to take action quickly and try to do our best, even if it was makeshift or something.

But now that the team has grown and we're focusing more on scaling, the nature of our work is changing. We feel like we're slowing down, but I think this is exactly the format we want to follow. We're really experiencing that change deeply. That's why it's like we're experiencing exactly what these people are going through, almost step by step, and that's why I feel so close to those parts here, man.

Yes. Also, especially at this time, we have this issue a lot; in a way, what we've been discussing until now is more about scale, and we're working on a new version with a more solid foundation, so I think it's normal that we're feeling that slowness . Because, until now, whenever we had a ship, whenever we had the chance to upgrade it, we said, "No, let's just speed up our engine and continue sailing with those little Zodiac boats."

But unfortunately, at certain points, or as you might say, life is like that, and you say, " I really need to upgrade to a higher-level ship now," but you also need to be careful not to make too many mistakes. I think, for example, this is one of the topics we've thought about the most after our last investment. So, every decision we make, every hiring, every position, etc., we discuss very thoroughly.

So, do we really need it ? Do we need it urgently? Do we really need this? We discussed that question extensively. Because, as I said, it makes you want to hire people, grow your team, buy more tools, and so on and so forth . It needs to be managed well. Absolutely, bro. I agree 100%. These are either trekers or gunsmiths. We talked about that too. So, there really needs to be three people in a team .

It will be in groups of three, three, three. Here's the wildcard: the designer, developer, and partner who handles everything . That's why it's such a great concept . I think if we expand the team a bit more, if the company grows, we could do something like this with a similar concept. This is already a sweet thing, like a striker in football, I mean, what's it called in football?

What's the Turkish equivalent of "Swiper"? Ibrahim abi is basically a sweeper, like he's somewhere in between those two things, like a midfielder, you mean? You know, the defensive kind . No, no, there was something a little more... something else . What is it called? Is he a golden boy or something? So, like, on the field in football, he's both a striker and... like, Messi, you know what I mean ?

I understood it both ways, but I'm not coming. Exactly. So he's saying do something that makes those three-person groups completely... TRUE. That's the basic thing about being lean, man . They summarized it very well. Yes. Priorities, brother. I think this is again the point we talk about the most here. It's a problem. The parts "It's a problem" and "what's the big idea" . So what exactly are you figuring out?

I think we need to establish that very clearly . So, everyone on the team, let's say Hardal, can solve this. This is the main point that Hardal solved, which, for example, we discussed a lot. Because at some point we had come back to that. It was a list of things you could solve with Hardal. huh. And there were about 20 headlines there. Right now, for example, we've reduced it back to one again.

So yes, there are things I can do with Hardal, but the main thing Ardal solves, the main thing Ardal gives you, is accurate data, and everything around it, all the other solutions, actually revolve around that. I think, for example, it was a very good step back and a step forward for us . It's important to do this from time to time and not forget it. Or are you really just struggling with the "nice to have future" dilemma?

So, also, since we tend to do whatever comes to mind, yes. The concept is very good. For example, compared to the previous one, you need to speed up because you're not in that state, logically speaking, but you shouldn't use that speed and force to do whatever comes to mind . This is very critical, in my opinion. For example, there's a field here called "ignore details early on" .

For example, these are the kinds of things we constantly overtick at. So, should one right-hand man go to the left, or one right-hand man go to the right? For example, should the pricing be like this here, or something else? Now, these things are so detailed that they start to overwhelm you after a while . Well, I even gave this example in the previous orders. For example, they've added animations to the background of the authentication screen .

I mean, it's such an irrelevant thing that it tires you out thinking about it here and there. That's why I find that funny, man. We've told people on our team, " Don't ask us any questions, we 're accidentally over-engineering." For example, let's say something happens. Sometimes Berkay and I get questions like this, but they're very unrelated, like, "We've created an agent, what should its name be?" This is incredible for us, you know, look, it's like, " look, it's perfect words," we rack our brains over it, we're obsessed with it.

Berkay and I drop everything and just focus on it letter by letter, like, " What will the slogan be? Let's describe Hardal in three words, or four words?" We work on it so much, it's like, like cryptonite, it suddenly sucks all our energy, everything, and we're stuck there until we solve it. That's why a person needs to know themselves. So, for example, I think I like this.

Don't ask us about this. Otherwise, we'll over-engineer you too. We ourselves become over-engineers. We're doomed. We'll burn you too. Exactly. Exactly. Okay brother, then we'll quickly move on to our next section. This is the issue we were talking about; they said "have not" here. So instead of doing multiple perching tasks, just focus on one thing, let that feature work properly, and concentrate on it. Well, that was something that kind of drew me in, really, about the product.

And focusing on that one thing in one place is much more important. And then there's that thing, like "start with no." I think that was one of the most difficult things for us, especially in the beginning. I think we're still struggling. I think we both have a lot of potential. We can do that too. There's a lot of squeaking. That's why I think we still say yes.

I think we need to say no to things more often. We should also consider this by default: I think there should be a difference between saying no and refusing. So, I think there's a distinction there. Is the main reason we say no because we won't put in the effort, or because we're resistant to change? Because if we say no without presenting a counter-argument, it would be like...

You know... Logically, we'll have to say no to everything that comes our way . But here, it seems like something related to the product side, or perhaps the business side as well; for example, a customer makes a request, and by default it's "no," but for some reason, that request needs to change to "yes." The fact that it's repetitive, that the customer is repeating what you said, that it's within their scope, that the IT team is within their scope, that they have sufficient resources, that they have the budget, etc., etc., I think there's a point here.

Yes. Yes, absolutely. And like I said, I think we say no much more often than we used to, but we still say things like, for example, instead of no, we say... more often. We often say, "Let's try it, let's see, let's tinker with it," and I think that's a very difficult thing to do. So it's very difficult from this point of view. Because think of every "yes" as something that will increase your turnover a little more .

Actually, that survival instinct makes you say... It makes you say yes. So we'll see in time. I also think we'll get better there, but I agree with the initial thoughts. We said yes to everything to each other, man. Yes, let's do it. Yes, let's do it, brother. One person isn't enough . Yes, that person. Even when there were only five of us, it was always a hectic period, always rushing around doing everything.

It was difficult. But let's see, we 've reached the processes section. For example, the part we're talking about here, as you mentioned, is where the programmer leaves almost everything to the customer, all the configuration work . Yes. This is where I find it very interesting, you know, when you approach it from a product perspective, something happens. So you tell me your name. It makes sense, I really like the idea that the developer's effort and the decision should actually be made by the product team.

I hadn't really looked at it that closely. Because they themselves are actually saying that initially, that's why I think they're saying it. Being part of the problem, and the IT team being familiar with that problem, means that the person doing the work is the one who will make the best decision . So here you are offering the guy who's going to eat the meal a bunch of options .

You can add salt or pepper to your dish. If you offer those options, the guy will accept them, but the food will be bad. In fact, we later called all of our customers individually at some point. You were the one who called, Emirli. So, what exactly do you use it for? We had filtered it so well that we avoided focusing on all the unused things, and we continued doing that there, for example .

Yes. And then there's this part, for example... So there's the wild part of the test. There's really no need to be afraid of that either Of course, sometimes they openly test things, and you know how they say, "not in a lab environment, but release it to the market , test it, and get feedback," that's the kind of approach that makes a lot of sense to me, that makes perfect sense .

Of course, these are more applicable to applications with 1000 or 2000 daily users. I think that stage, like us, is a bit more B2, meaning things that appeal to the end user, but since we're more focused on enterprise, things can change a bit there. Of course, when the customization aspect comes into play, you really become more inclined to shape things . Now we come to the organizational structure, which we've already discussed.

For example, Alon Time is amazing. What we've been constantly trying to do is to disconnect ourselves from Slack and work on our own for a while. So, having these meetings and other things going on all the time is very distracting. So, guys, I'll say a few things here too. Here, for example, under the heading "Unity," I think there's a difficult part to this kind of work .

And that's it. We, for example, put a lot of thought into this, and it's one of the biggest challenges for everyone who joins the team at first . And that's it. Yes, there need to be small teams inside, but these small teams need to communicate incredibly well with each other. And we always have that thing. For example, I'm constantly telling the product team, "You need to know how to sell the product."

You need to know how the product is marketed. Or, the salesperson should know the technical capabilities of the product. We overemphasize the importance of knowing every detail of the product, inside and out, including the product roadmap, and so on . And the first thing we always get is, let's say, this . My job is sales, why do I need to know so much technical stuff? I think that's why, if you divide those syllables, at some point there's so much disconnect inside that even we experience it.

In our team of 15, sometimes people do n't even know what each other is doing, and we're always shocked . So we say, "How can they not know this?", but people are very prone to this, focusing on their own interests, their own personal lives, but I think creating a team, a structure where everyone is aware of the meme, is quite critical. I think this side is very, very important.

And that's the point we always get stuck on, I mean, it's really like that Loston Translation . And there's another thing... We already had difficulty understanding each other even in Turkish, and now we've started speaking English within the team . Because more globally oriented people have arrived. So, to really express it clearly, what do they call the word "thing" or "mess"? What was he saying? He was saying one thing.

Just because you're talking about the same thing doesn't mean you've reached an agreement . Just because we both agree on the same word doesn't mean we've reached an agreement. Because you understand that word differently than I do . Yes. Communication is really at the root of this whole thing, it's the most important thing. Indeed, for example, the event before this incident is a very good example. So, we've been working together for years now.

You're one of the people I talk to the most in my life. Despite that, we did have a conversation like this. You have our Hardal merchandise, and it needs to reach me. Actually, shipping costs are very high in different countries. I'm telling you, I'll give you an address, but out of nowhere, could you send our flags and new t-shirts to this address ? Because I didn't give you the information that this person would be coming to Barcelona, that he was my friend, and that they would contact me, you suddenly asked, "Why are we sending this flag?

Are we giving it as a gift?" But we don't have many flags or anything like that. Your mind is somewhere else, and I'm somewhere else entirely . So, of course we solved it quickly . But even there, the communication breakdown is so obvious that imagine people who don't know each other speaking in a language that isn't their native tongue, and it's written in a technical and technical way.

Exactly. So it's incredible, it's actually a challenge. That's absolutely true . So let's make our voice heard from here. Who should we call out to from here? Companies to bosses. I think the critical message here is to communicate by asking questions directly, writing clearly, and providing more detail, even if it means spending just a few extra minutes, without making assumptions . Exactly. Because the load on that thing isn't moving linearly.

Well, with missing information, you can't stay in the same direction until you reach the end. It takes much more than that. So the sooner you pay off that debt, the better. There's no "dummy question," man. I didn't understand that part. Why did you do that? I think it's fantastic to start working on something only after truly establishing a meaningful connection between the two dialogues, by asking follow-up questions like, "Okay, we're doing this, but what exactly are we doing?"

I have two more headings related to the previous one. I've gone on a bit, but there was one thing that happened during the "alone time" part, and there was a guy who said something like this... I've forgotten who it is, but they say, "For example, I've also started doing that recently." I try to finalize my week and days the day before. And that person over there says something like this.

So I plan my day based on the day before because I don't like to wing it. So, he's saying he doesn't want to just spend the day wherever the wind blows. It resonated incredibly with me. So, from your point of view, this is actually what's bothering me about that focus time issue. So, actually, waking up in the morning and not knowing my plans for the day bothers me .

That's why I said planning the day before worked so well for me. I recommend it to those who don't do it. I think it makes a huge difference . And sometimes, when you compare what you planned to what you actually did at the end of the day, you're shocked. So, you planned everything, only to be unable to do anything. I think it's a pretty effective process. about this topic.

I wanted to add it. Absolutely, bro, I'm 100% sure. I even started doing something similar; you know, one day a week I automatically shift my unfinished tasks to the next day. That's what my agenda system does, and I even converted it to obsidian or something. I mean, I really am. I had a plan for the morning, I did a lot of work, but I spent 8 hours in front of the computer and I still haven't done those three things I wrote here .

So what did I do instead of them ? His question mark is the unplanned adoc tasks. That's why working in a truly closed-loop, time-based environment is so important. So, turning off those instant messages means you need to distance yourself from Adoc EDOC. Because EDOC isn't just about someone knocking on your door at work, saying "Hey, can you take a look?", that's one of the things that will modernize this place.

Actually, he's not talking about remote culture here. So in remote culture, where people are constantly working from home, I think there are many more things to pay attention to. Yes. You'll have laundry to dry, you'll be cooking at home while you're eating, you'll have to do the dishes, and so on. Therefore, I think things like this are distracting. Yes. Exactly. Exactly. Yes. Then we'll go through it quickly.

Brother, you say quickly, but should we make it 45 parts? We'll need to do Part 3. So, I have a lot to say. Let's stop here and do part 3 later. I think I'll do it like this. Let's stop here at Staffing . Should we do Part 3 later? I think we should do it later. We're tired, son. Yes, it's been 1.5 hours. Okay then, let's really make it part 3.

It's nice, but I think we can connect it with that. that episode won't make for a good series. I want to say this. The part is in the previous part, Part 2, Chapter 39, Celebrate Small Victories. This is something I think we used to do very rarely. As the team grew, we started doing exactly that even more with the Kudos channel and so on . The event goes beyond celebrating small things; it says "seek and" there.

So sometimes you really need to look for little things to celebrate. You really need to ask yourself, "What did we do this week to celebrate?" or "What did I do?" Well, people forget things in the daily routine. So, what we do in the weekly reports is actually one point, but let's go a little further, for example, what did we do internally for this? So, in Sürek, we created a separate channel, a Kudos channel.

We genuinely believe it motivates people. They motivate and applaud each other . We even did something themed around Fatih Terim. Let it be. Let's keep our spirits high. Enes made the boat. Let's give him a shoutout from here too. So, there's really something here that we've been discussing, especially regarding those topics . Or maybe we should stop and celebrate, I mean, just sit down and maybe pop a bottle of champagne, for example.

It's important to celebrate small events that occur as a result of big events, you know, really, from time to time. Look, this was our cloud costume last week . We've reduced it to this level this month or something. So, things like that, or someone has created an app. Things are moving faster inside. It wasn't there yesterday, but it is today. I think it's very valuable to bridge that gap in this way.

Yes. Our weekly sing meetings are somewhat helpful for him. I mean, we're even celebrating that thing, man. For example, every week we have a running club on Strava. We will be doing our official Dike runs. If this comes out before that, for example, even there, it's exactly like that . So, we even celebrate things like, "Well done!" or " Emir did 10 hours of exercise this week," or "Theoman ran 70 km," and so on.

These headlines are completely irrelevant to the company, but even celebrating them, I think, well, celebrating them is nice. Definitely. I even had an idea. So let's make these celebrations public as well . So, let's really celebrate this on LinkedIn. What's going to happen ? Thank God we're active on LinkedIn, so I think we should be celebrating. I find LinkedIn really cringe-worthy, still, but I don't know... For example, I just shared our Fast Company 100 thingy.

It's cringeworthy, but it needs to be shared. Trying to get such an impression from these issues, beyond the celebration itself, is something else entirely . We are actually doing the second one . So we're not celebrating anything there. We're trying to get an impression from there by showing that we celebrated there . So this is also a bit about awareness, increasing visibility, like founder-led and that kind of strategy we have.

But generally speaking, we don't really have anything specific to that place. So, we don't really have a specific LinkedIn strategy in mind. We're just sharing it from there . That's where the interaction happens. Because we're talking about business-related things, I thought we should gradually start sharing these aspects of business as well . So let's try to take LinkedIn outside its usual scope. So, let's not create a new Twitter there, but just because it's purely business-wise, let's not turn it into a business-centric platform and start sharing things there, which we've been doing constantly for almost a year now.

TRUE. I think that's great. So, I think this is one of the reasons why we continue watching, even if we find it cringeworthy. Yes, brother. Then we can imagine a world where we celebrate more, and perhaps even make it public . Exactly. So, in part 2 of our podcast, we've reached about halfway through the book. We had made such an introduction upfront . That was the first part.

We only managed to get halfway through the second part. In the third part, God willing, if we can, we will finish the book to the end. There are some great topics. So almost every topic is one that we've already discussed . That's why we enjoy watching it so much, as I said. So, my intention is really to modernize this book a bit, to modify it according to current problems, frameworks, and current working conditions .

So what do they say? Could it be our turn to take over the baton ? We've been together for almost four years now. They have also been in a partnership for 20 years. I think we can do something like this in our next five years. So, think of them like this, bro, 20 bro. Think of it this way: doesn't this book, featuring Jason and DH, logically correspond to their five-year relationship?

I don't know, man. Now, on the one hand, something like this seems crazy . Of course, whether it's 1995 or 2000, there's already data from those 20 years ago. There, the horse is 5. The horse is 5, that makes 40. I mean, that's what I was trying to say. We've had a year together to write a book like this. Do you think it worked? Wow. Have we received that much information?

I don't know. A little more experience makes a person... well, you know. " No way, it couldn't have been that bad," he says, but anyway, let's think about it, why not? Thank you for your valuable time. A waltz was a fantastic start for me. I agree, it turned out to be a fantastic podcast series. Your t-shirt is really nice, by the way. They can also buy it from the nearest website.

It 's available online. That's really good. You wear M, now S? I wear size M. brother M, M is really bad. What? It's great that you're taking such good care of it. I'm happy, brother. You, you... you know, like I said last week, everything looks great on you, but... Hey X, think about this XX large shirt I'm wearing, and it feels incredibly small to me. I mean, you're new here, but you're not exactly an XX large guy, are you?

How does this happen, man? So, last summer I was someone who wore M. Maybe I gained a little weight and went up to size, but this kind of promotion, yes. So, because the patterns have changed a bit, I can't trust M at all with these kinds of things . Try saying that. Did you wear this one, the white one? I had the letter and the letter L in the sample packs.

But I think you should get an original. Because I think the legacies of the samples aren't accurate either . Then you don't have that. But I haven't opened my box. My box is still here, man. I attach great importance to those kinds of things . Why would I open it after all these years, bro? Years from now, we'll open it and say, " Open this unopened Hardal jar."

No, no, I mean, if you came to me with that box five years later, wouldn't you get emotional? I get emotional. Well, there you go, but you don't have a t-shirt to show off. You've been wearing it here and there. Well, I have that too, man. This is great, we're really looking forward to this from the metal community. Our hat is also from San Francisco. Let's go then.

Okay then, let's get back to work. It's actually 1.5 hours. Thank you all for watching and listening . See you in part 3 . Goodbye.